One Thing Nobody Does in Parish Ministry Job Interviews

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Are you looking for a way to stand out in your next parish ministry job interview? Here’s one simple thing that I’m shocked almost no one does—yet it could dramatically increase your chances of getting hired and enhance your ministry as a whole.

Stand Out in Parish Ministry Job Interviews

In my 10 years of parish ministry, I’ve been on both sides of the interview table—applying for positions and interviewing potential hires. One thing that consistently surprises me is how few ministers can articulate this one crucial thing: a clear ministry framework.

What is a Ministry Framework?

A framework is a simple structure for organizing a complex idea. In ministry, a framework provides clarity, not just for job interviews, but for your entire approach to ministry. It helps you communicate your vision, recruit volunteers, and get your pastor or parish staff on board with your goals.

The best ministry frameworks give a clear definition of your goal and outline the strategy you’ll use to achieve it. It simplifies decision-making and helps you communicate effectively with others.

Why a Framework is Critical in Interviews

Imagine this: You’re in an interview and the pastor asks, “Tell me about your approach to ministry.” Now, instead of fumbling through a vague explanation, you confidently respond with a clear, structured framework. Not only does this make you look organized and prepared, but it shows that you’ve put serious thought into how you’ll lead and guide the parish.

In my interviews—both as an applicant and as an interviewer—I always look for whether someone can articulate their framework for ministry. It’s a great indicator of how well they understand their role and how clearly they can communicate their strategy.

Common Ministry Frameworks You’ve Probably Seen

Frameworks are everywhere in ministry, even if you haven’t noticed them before.

For example:

• Sherry Weddell’s Forming Intentional Disciples outlines the thresholds of conversion. FOCUS (Fellowship of Catholic University Students) uses Win, Build, Send.

• Pat Lencioni’s The Five Dysfunctions of a Team offers a leadership framework.

• The Amazing Parish identifies three building blocks of a healthy parish.

• Even the catechumenate process for initiating adults into the Church is a framework with distinct stages.

The good news? You don’t have to create your own framework from scratch. You can learn from others, adopt their frameworks, or modify them to fit your ministry context—just be sure to acknowledge where the ideas come from.

How to Articulate Your Framework in an Interview

When asked about your approach to ministry, here’s an example of how you can present your framework:

“I believe this parish ministry exists to evangelize. My framework for evangelization is based on forming missionary disciples through a clear path of discipleship. I break this path down into four stages: Connect, Encounter, Grow, and Serve.”

This response provides structure, clarity, and leaves room for deeper questions. Each element of the framework (evangelization, missionary discipleship, connect/encounter/grow/serve) can be expanded upon as the interview continues.

How to Develop Your Own Ministry Framework

Ready to get started? Follow these steps:

1. Read and Pray: Immerse yourself in ministry books, frameworks, and prayer.

2. Clarify Your Purpose: Ask yourself, “What is the purpose of my ministry?”

3. Define Your Strategy: Next, ask, “How will I achieve this purpose?”

4. Highlight Key Components: Identify the three to four most important aspects of your approach.

The more you refine these answers, the clearer your framework will become.

Want to Learn More?

For those interested in going deeper into framework thinking, I highly recommend two resources:

• Vicky Zhao’s YouTube channel on framework thinking.

• Pat Lencioni’s book, The Ideal Team Player. While frameworks are essential, Lencioni’s insights into the qualities of a great team player—humble, hungry, and smart—are invaluable for making sure you get that job offer.

If this idea interests you and you’re in parish ministry, be sure to check out more in-depth videos on my YouTube channel!

How to Read Minds in Parish Ministry

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In ministry, have you ever felt like no one cares? Maybe it’s a struggle to get people to show up, engage on social media, or even open your emails. You stand in front of a group, and it feels like everyone is scrolling their phones, barely listening. This feeling is all too familiar, but there’s a way to change it—and it starts with one question.

But first, let’s talk about an important mindset shift:

You can’t preach the gospel to an empty stomach.

This idea, often attributed to Mother Teresa, is simple but powerful. When someone is hungry or struggling, the last thing they want to do is sit and listen to a message, no matter how important it may be. Their personal struggle takes precedence. This is a reality we need to embrace in parish ministry.

Why People Seem Disengaged

Many times, people aren’t uninterested in what the church offers because they don’t care. Instead, they believe their struggles are more urgent or that what’s offered isn’t connected to their daily challenges.

So, how do we address this?

Ask This One Question

To begin “reading people’s minds” in ministry, ask them this:

What is your biggest struggle or challenge in life right now?

This simple question can unlock insights that will reshape how you engage with your parishioners. You can include it in emails, surveys, or even anonymous index cards handed out during events. The key is to make it easy for them to respond and, most importantly, to really listen to their answers.

The Surprising Results

When we did this at my parish, the responses were eye-opening. One of the most common challenges was disciplining children. This wasn’t something we had expected, but it completely changed the way we crafted our ministries and events.

Most parish ministers don’t really know what their people are struggling with. Or, even if they do, they don’t know the right language to address these issues in a way that resonates.

By asking this question, you get the words directly from the people you serve, making your ministry more relevant to their lives.

Using the Answers to Engage Your Parishioners

Once you have their responses, you can use that language to shape your content, programs, and messaging. When parishioners start hearing their struggles reflected in your events, they’ll feel like you’re speaking directly to them. They’ll say things like, “I feel like this ministry is exactly what I needed,” or “You were reading my mind!”

And even though you can’t solve everyone’s problems, you can help them understand how the gospel message speaks to their lives—and when possible, offer practical help.

An Example of Relevance

Too often, parish events are advertised with vague promises: “Join us for a transformative retreat where you’ll connect with Jesus and spend time in prayer.” While this may appeal to some, many others are focused on the daily grind of balancing work, family, and life.

Imagine how much more engaging it would be to promote that same retreat with language like:

“Are you feeling stretched too thin? Struggling with work-life balance?

Come to this retreat to recharge and reprioritize your life.”

We used this simple question to craft an after-Mass mini-series for parents, addressing their real struggles. It wasn’t just another program—it was something that spoke directly to their needs. As a result, we saw engagement from people who had previously been disconnected from the parish.

What About You?

Now, I’d love to hear from you. Should I make another video about the adult mini-series we used to engage disengaged parents? Or should I dive into another topic? Let me know in the comments below!

And while you’re at it, tell me about your biggest challenge in parish ministry right now—I’d love to help.

Coming soon... Live Workshop

I’m working on a live workshop to help any parish ministers plan a better year of ministry. More info to come soon!

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Making a Video Podcast Creative Studio.... Studio Vlog 02

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I Have the Perfect Youth Ministry

You read that right. I have the perfect youth ministry. There are only 5 youth in the program, but these kids are gonna change the world. We have a small budget. But, we meet every day of the week. You wanna talk relational ministry? I spend HOURS with these kids.

I’m working with the parents to make sure there is really good catechesis happening in the home. We do social events, retreats, discipleship, and I show them how to pray. Sometimes we have small groups, sometimes I just answer their questions. We go on trips together and share meals together. I post a lot about the program on social media.

I’ve been working with these five kids for almost 7 years now, and my goal is to work with each kid intentionally for at least 18+ years. Long-term mindset. You could say that I really love these kids.

Because they’re my literal children.

I reject the false dichotomy between parish youth ministry and the family. There’s no competition. The best youth ministry is the one you’re running if you’re a parent. There’s no perfect model of youth ministry.

Small group discipleship isn’t the perfect model. Large groups aren’t perfect. Discipleship. Stewardship. Outreach. Evangelization. Missionary Discipleship. Commitment to multiplication.

Pick a vision. None of them are perfect.

The next time you hear someone trash a specific youth ministry model or method, ask yourself, are they basically just pointing out how this model fails in comparison to a family?

Or is there a legitimate flaw in the methodology in light of the pedagogy of God, or the way God works with man?

The perfect youth ministry was the Holy Family. But this doesn’t mean that parish youth ministry shouldn’t exist. Even Jesus went to learn in the synagogue.

How can your church support family youth ministry?
How can your church reach youth who don’t yet have a youth ministry at home?

Gotta go, one of the kids in my youth ministry just pooped his pants.

4 Reasons for the Incarnation

I’ve wanted to make a video about the four reasons for the incarnation for a year now, and I finally pulled it off. I hope you enjoy it!

Why You Need "Strategy Mondays" [video]

If you work for a Church (or set your own hours) you know it can be tough to manage your time and your week, let alone the month. Here's how I use "strategy Mondays" to review projects, plan for the week, and accomplish big goals each quarter.

Review all inboxes.

This includes physical mailboxes, any loose piles in my office, voicemail, email, Asana etc.

Review all projects.

We use Asana as a team to manage projects and tasks. I force myself to click through EVERY open and active project and review all the tasks that will be required to complete the project. If it isn't worth reviewing, it shouldn't be a project. You'll be surprised at how big a difference this will make.

Review the week.

Once I've looked through all the active projects I open my calendar and try to get a clear picture in my head about what will make this week successful and what big things need to get done. Often this requires some action or prep to take place on Monday to set up for that Thursday lunch meeting or that weekend ministry.

Review the month.

Next I look at the next 4 weeks and try to find any planning or prep that isn't accounted for in Asana or isn't scheduled in already.

Review the quarter.

This is the long-term view that forces me to focus on the bigger picture. It forces me to ask: what are we trying to accomplish this Fall, Spring, or Summer? What is it going to take to get there? Am I on track for the goals and projects we are trying to accomplish? Will I look back at this summer and feel proud, accomplished, and docile to the Holy Spirit?

Weekly Wifey Pow-Wow

Arguably the most important part of Mondays, every Monday I make sure my wife is informed about what is going on at work, and I am up to date on what we are planning for the week as a family. We share a google calendar for work and home and text back and forth a bit to make sure we're on the same page.

How do you make sure you're on top of everything week to week?

How people drift away from our church

Meet Susan.

Susan is a 75 year old widower who’s considered herself Catholic her whole life, even though her and her husband stopped attending church twenty years ago. Last year after the death of her husband a friend invited her to attend a weekend retreat called Christ Renews His Parish (CRHP). After going on the retreat last fall and encountering Jesus, her faith has come alive. She knows she wants more, but she’s not sure where to start. She senses that she needs friends who are “involved at the church”, and she realizes she doesn’t know anything about the faith, so she should probably find some way to learn more. She also senses the need to volunteer or serve at the parish. Susan starts coming to Mass every Sunday, she reads the bulletin, and she’s looked at our parish website.

Susan is not sure what the next step for her should be. What should Susan do?

Susan really feels like she doesn’t know her faith as well as she should.

Maybe she should go through the RCIA class just to brush up, or maybe she should checkout formed.org and pick one of the 300 studies offered and just start there. There’s a group meeting weekly that is going through the Great Adventure Bible Timeline. There’s a group going through the Catholicism series. There’s a group going through Symbolon. Susan hears a class is offered at the parish that is reading through Moby Dick from a Christian perspective. That sounds interesting. There is another “bible study” that has been meeting at the parish for the last 20 years. There is a parish mission coming up. There’s a group that reads through the writings of this guy named Chesterton at a local bar.

Susan wants to “get involved”.

Susan remembers the women who served on the CRHP weekend, and they all seemed very active and involved. They seemed really happy and fulfilled in their role too. Susan feels the desire and need to “get involved” too. There’s countless opportunities to serve at the parish, and everyone seems in desperate need of help. Maybe Susan shouldn’t attend a weekly Bible study, but should just start by helping out? Susan could start lectoring, or ushering, or start teaching, or visiting the sick and homebound, or become a Eucharistic minister. Maybe Susan should get involved by becoming a marriage sponsor, or joining the prayer group for seniors, or the pro-life group, or the grief ministry, or joining the Lady Knights of Columbus.

Susan wants to learn how to pray.

Susan has heard people say daily mass is important, and adoration, and the rosary, and Liturgy of the Hours, and praying through the Magnificat, and the angelus; and there are groups that meet weekly for all of those as well.

Susan would like to meet other people her age who also want to grow in their faith.

There’s a mom’s group and another group for women and a parish picnic coming up. Again she thinks about joining the Lady Knights or a prayer group for seniors, but she’s wondering if those things would help her learn the faith.

Some of these opportunities meet some of Susan’s needs, but not others. Most of these opportunities meet weekly. Susan doesn’t have all the time in the world.

Susan is not sure what the next step for her should be. What should Susan do?

In an ideal world, every choice is a fine one. Susan will pick something that appeals to her, and she’ll find her way. Eventually she’ll find what she needs, and try everything out, and figure out a healthy balance to her new life with Jesus in the Church. God works through everything our church offers.

But that doesn’t always happen. Lots of people “just gradually drift away.”

I believe people gradually drift away because they try a few things that don’t meet the needs of where they are in the process of evangelization. If they do happen to attend something that meets their specific need, they either get stuck there or they don’t know what is next.

Maybe after a year or two we find that Susan has only tried being a lector, joined a rosary group, and went to one bible study. Susan starts wondering if church just isn’t for her. She still feels disconnected and the hundreds of programs and books and resources make her feel intimidated to learn the faith - there’s just too much to learn. New programs and opportunities are constantly advertised, but Susan feels she’s tried everything. Susan starts slowly drifting away. She stops coming to say the rosary. She feels drained by the different service events she’s been roped into. She doesn’t want to go to anymore classes. She's not sure this is for her anymore.

Susan is just tired of Church.

How can we help Susan?

People at our parish are all at different stages in the process of evangelization, or the process of becoming an intentional disciple of Jesus Christ. We don't need better programs or better resources or better liturgy or better education or better buildings or better outreach or better Priests.

What we need is to communicate what the journey of discipleship looks like - from outside the Church all the way to sainthood - and help people identify clearly and simply what they need at the stage they are at. Or better still, what committed disciples should invite their friend or neighbor to. We need to give people context for all the hundreds of things we offer them. We need to give people a framework to wade through what is most important and essential and what is not. 

I believe we need to stop relying on apostolates and ministries and resources to articulate what this path of discipleship looks like. As parishes we need to stop leaving it up to every ministry or group in our parish to communicate this path for the church, based on whatever program or resource they are using. Instead every parish should provide a clear path of discipleship for its parishioners. 

Communicate a Clear Path of Discipleship

I don't think this is the only answer, but I think this is one answer that would help tremendously. 

The catechumenate is an ancient model of Christian initiation that has been used in some form since the Early Church. It is the process of evangelization that leads a person on the fringes outside the Church into full sacramental communion with Jesus Christ within the Church. In our post-Christian cultural context of Catholics who are sacramentalized but not evangelized, I think the catechumenate is still a powerful organizing model for evangelization, because of its focus on conversion and movement. The catechumenate exists in a seminal form as early as Acts 2. The Church has been calling us to this kind of model for decades. 

"The model for all catechesis is the baptismal catechumenate when, by specific formation, an adult converted to belief is brought to explicit profession of baptismal faith during the Paschal Vigil". This catechumenal formation should inspire the other forms of catechesis in both their objectives and in their dynamism." General Directory for Catechesis #59

It's time our parish communicated a clear path of discipleship, organized all their ministries around a clear path of discipleship, measured success at the macro level through the lense of a clear path of discipleship, and balanced the energy and resources of the parish around a clear path of discipleship.

What might this look like?

There are other people who are trying this out. I'm not making this all up from scratch, and I'm not the only one sensing this need. I'm writing up a longer draft of what we've come up with so far for our parish, and I'll clarify what a clear path of discipleship might look like at a parish, specifically our parish, as we prayerfully plan and move forward with this vision, and ultimately Susan, in mind.

Books I Wish I Read My First Year of Catholic Youth Ministry

These books aren't the usual required reading recommended to aspiring Catholic youth ministers. That's for another article. But looking back on the last seven years, these are books I wish I read my first year on the job as a Catholic youth minister. 

There are plenty of well-known books about youth ministry, and plenty of Catholic books youth ministers should read. But if you are interested in venturing off that well-worn path there are several books that helped me immensely. (This article contains Amazon affiliate links.)

The War of Art
by Steven Pressfield

What it's about:

This short book is a kick in the pants about overcoming the resistance we all face when trying to "make" anything worth making. Steven Pressfield describes accurately the human patterns we all fall for when faced with  important, large, or difficult work we need to do. 

Why you should read it:

As a youth minister, you set most of your own schedule and work on projects and tasks when you decide to. If you're not careful you'll unintentionally fall for the resistance traps Steven describes in the book: avoiding the most important work and instead finding other less important but easier to accomplish work to complete, leaving you feeling busy all day but your important projects left untouched.

For instance, you'll try to sit down and write a parent handbook – something you know is important and you've been avoiding for months – you'll suddenly find yourself redesigning your youth ministry facebook page instead. Which, you know, doesn't matter too much. 

Getting Things Done
by David Allen

What it's about:

David Allen describes a system for keeping track of everything and getting things done. He describes an easy and adaptable framework anyone can use to keep track of to-do lists, projects, and deadlines. He creates a system you can implement that will stop you from ever forgetting to follow through on anything ever again. 

Why you should read it: 

It wouldn't be that far off to say this book changed my life. You're going to have hundreds, probably thousands, of details, projects, tasks, emails, phone calls, dates, and paperwork involved while doing your job. Heck not just your job, everything in your life. Keeping a to-to list won't work in youth ministry. There's just too much to remember, too much to keep track of, and too many projects to stay on top of.

If you don't have a system in place, you'll try to keep all this in your head, and you'll end up having an anxiety attack as your brain fries itself trying to make sure you don't drop one of the hundreds of balls you're juggling. You'll end up becoming, in the eyes of everyone around you, the classic youth minister that never answers emails or voicemails, is unprepared, absent minded, and unorganized. You'll also have a harder time keeping work at work when you come home.

If you have a reliable system in place your brain can relax when you get home and not randomly remind you to send an email, because you'll know everything is taken care of.

The Non-Designers Design Book
by Robin Williams

What it's about:

A simple approach to a few design principles that anyone can learn and that immediately give you a better eye for design and, more importantly, the language to communicate what makes crappy design crappy.

Why you should read it: 

In the end, being great at graphic design isn't necessary for being the youth minister God called you to be. But if you're just starting out, you're probably frustrated by the crappy design you're seeing around you at the parish you just started working at. Or maybe you're wanting to try your hand at making the  flyer for an upcoming event a little better. This short book will explain four principles for design that can be applied to anything you want to make look good.

Most importantly, you don't want to become "that young kid" who just hates everyone's designs. This book will give you more constructive things to say than just "it doesn't look good". You'll be able to appeal to design principles like proximity, alignment, contrast, and repetition. You'll also learn the basics of using and combining colors, basic elements of typography, and how to combine fonts. 

Deep Work
by Cal Newport

What it's about: 

This is the longer and more in-depth follow up to The War of Art mentioned above. Cal Newport describes deep work as "the ability to focus without distraction on a cognitively demanding task" and makes the case that deep work produces the most valuable results in any job or field and is a rare skill in today's world of distractions. Cal not only gives you advice on how to eliminate distractions in the workplace but also gives examples and habits you can adopt to cultivate the power of deep work in your own profession.

Why you should read it: 

As mentioned above, the life of a youth minister requires discerning between what is urgent and not important, and what is important and not urgent. Deep work that produces big results in the life of a youth minister involve things like developing a retreat, or planning a curriculum for the year, or reading a few books on discipleship and planning how to shift your ministry towards a small-group approach.

The ability to think hard and work deeply on a project or thought is invaluable, and not everyone comes out of college with the ability to do this. Without structure and direction, you can end up spending too much time researching, reading, and thinking without producing any results or finishing a project. But the opposite extreme would be constantly answering emails and updating social media, without ever taking the time to tune out all the less-important distractions and really develop a project you need to work on.

This book helped me set aside an appropriate amount of time each week to "practice" my deep work. It has helped me develop a pastoral plan for the parish, create core team training, think about how to shift our ministry towards discipleship groups, and helped me articulate a vision for our youth ministry that we have used for more than three years. This all required focused and structured deep work that at first I was not good at.

The Advantage
by Pat Lencioni

What it's about: 

Pat Lencioni is a master at organizational health. That's a phrase that just means the way a group of people work together to accomplish a goal. This book proposes a model and a few important principles for a group of people to get stuff done together and stay focused on results and the goal, without getting caught up in politics or inefficiency.

Why you should read it: 

This book will help you understand how your parish staff could work better together, and will equip you with skills you'll need to lead a team of volunteers or to work with any coworkers who are also in youth ministry – like another youth minister or an assistant.

After reading this book, our team started having weekly meetings, started holding each other accountable to tasks and projects, and came up with our core values for the culture we want to create at our parish. When I read a lot of the principles and habits in this book I couldn't believe that I hadn't been doing some of them since day one. These past seven years of ministry would have been drastically different and I would have accomplished so much more had I read this sooner.

Divine Renovation
by Fr. James Mallon

What it's about: 

Fr. James Mallon describes his journey to answer the call to make disciples and the work it took to take a parish from maintenance to mission. Fr. Mallon provides the background from Church documents to support his vision while also getting practical enough to provide a framework for a few key areas of the parish.

Why you should read it: 

Okay, this is the first book on this list I'm sure a lot of you have heard recommended and talked about in Catholic ministry circles. The reason I included it in this list is because every book I read up until reading this book only contained bits and pieces of various topics. This book brought together a lot of the good stuff out there on topics like evangelization, catechesis, the missionary dimension of the parish, discipleship, worship, and how to vision bigger than just one ministry at a parish.

This book is just a great synthesis of so many ideas and currents of thought in the Church and in ministries committed to making disciples in our modern time. This book will give you a broader view of what your parish could be and how your youth ministry can support a missionary view of the Church instead of an attitude of maintenance.

I also believe that Fr. Mallon wrote one of the most succinct and complete summaries of our recent Church history of evangelization and catechesis. In just a few pages he covers the currents leading up to Vatican II and the themes and issues we've faced in the Church after Vatican II. He also highlights the renewal and shift in evangelization and catechesis originating in Popes, synods, and Church documents. I thought it was so great I scanned and printed this chapter and distributed it to my entire parish staff. It's that important.

The Master Plan of Evangelism
by Dr. Robert E. Coleman

What it's about: 

Dr. Coleman uses only the Bible to answer the question: What was Jesus' strategy for evangelization? He distills Jesus' approach to a few key habits and makes a case for a simple, small, and practical approach to discipleship that looks much more like holy friendship with a few than preaching to thousands.

Why you should read it: 

I know this book is passed around in some circles like FOCUS, but for some reason I never heard of it. When you feel stressed and overwhelmed by the call God has placed on your heart, or when you feel like there are just way too many youth in your parish and not enough time, take this book and go away from the parish for a day and read it straight through. It is refreshing to your ministry, soaked in scripture, and reminds you of what is actually the most important thing to do – discipling a few deeply instead of preaching to the many.

I read this book straight through on a flight and felt like I had spent three hours with Jesus himself talking about discipleship and learning to see ministry through His eyes. I recommend returning to this book at least once a year.

Evangelii Gaudium
by Pope Francis

What it's about: 

Pope Francis' apostolic exhortation on the Church's mission of evangelization in the modern world. 

Why you should read it:

Okay, okay, I know. This book is widely known and you've probably already heard about it so why does it make the list? If you're in youth ministry, the three Church documents you should read that cover the scope of your ministry are: Evangelii Nuntiandi (on Evangelization in the Modern World), Catechesii Tradendae (On Catechesis in Our Time), and Redemptoris Missio (Mission of the Redeemer). These three books will give you a framework for the missionary and evangelistic dimension of Catholic youth ministry, as well as a healthy and evangelistic approach to catechesis. (Catechesii Tradendae is an under-appreciated document because people assume its only about teaching the faith to those who've already been evangelized. When in fact it addresses the need for kerygmatic-catechesis and provides principles for evangelical catechesis to cultural Catholics who need to know the Gospel. You'll be a better youth minister if you read it yearly.)

So why Evangelii Gaudium? When I read this document by Pope Francis, it was like all the things I loved about EN, CT, and RM had all been combined into one document with a direct and practical style that really resonates. If you don't read any Church documents, read this one. Even better, read it and then read or teach parts of it to your core team.

What books would you add?

Let me know in the comments what books you wish you read your first year working as a Catholic Youth Minister. Extra points if they are lesser-known, off the beaten path type books that had a big impact on your overall ministry or life in youth ministry.